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	<title>Comments on: The Red, White and Blue: Forever May it Wave!</title>
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	<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/07/02/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/</link>
	<description>Conservative and Libertarian Intellectual Philosophy and Politics</description>
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		<title>By: Bob Stapler</title>
		<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/07/02/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/comment-page-1/#comment-11717</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Stapler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jul 2006 00:03:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/#comment-11717</guid>
		<description>Mr. Meller contradicts himself when he says: 

“An attitude of militarism and warmongering defaces the Star Spangled Banner, seriously compromising its value to our nation whose ideals, at least, always included peace, even though we would be prepared to fight to DEFEND ourselves!”  

By his own admission, self-defense is not warmongering and that is precisely the case the Star Spangled Banner describes.  Only the final verse of the poem makes any reference to conquest, and that he must be taking out of context.  The full final stanza of the poem reads:

“O thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand 
Between their loved home and the war&#039;s desolation! 
Blest with victory and peace, may the Heaven-rescued land 
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation. 
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just, 
And this be our motto: “In God is our trust.” 
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave 
O&#039;er the land of the free and the home of the brave!”

&#039;Conquer&#039; in this context (and as commonly used in Keys time) included conquering an enemy attacking us on our own soil .  Throughout his poem, Keys describes the valiant fight by Americans defending home and country against an enemy out to destroy us and deprive us of freedom.  Is this not precisely the case Mr. Meller makes as being legitimate?

It is clear, however, Meller is not just against aggressive war but against all war, and can find ample means to vilify defensive war as he does aggression by simply imposing extraneous causes that justify our enemies.  This is hardly a new theme, and Meller’s complaint rings hollow with it.

Meller, like many pacifists, would hobble us against all war on the presumption there is never a legitimate or just case for it.  He would have us restrict ourselves to defense only against invasion once the enemy is on our soil and has every advantage.  Frequently in war, that is too late and suicidal.  Enemies do not invade when their strength is insufficient to their designs; they invade when success seems a foregone conclusion.  Pacifism often seems noble, but it can also be incredibly stupid.

It is interesting Meller mentions Irving Berlin and the congressman who objected on the basis of Berlin&#039;s Jewishness.  I am also a Jew and I know this story.   The story is apocryphal, though it may have substance.  However, it is unlikely that all the congressmen who voted down the proposal were motivated by bigotry.   Many simply saw no reason to change our national anthem, and I tend to agree.  America the Beautiful is a great song.  So are Battle Cry of Freedom, The Battle Hymn of the Republic,  God Bless the USA, Hail Columbia, The Liberty Bell, My Country, &#039;Tis of Thee, This is My Country, This Land Is Your Land, You&#039;re a Grand Old Flag.  And, so is our Star Spangled Banner.  Our anthem recalls a moment in our history when our country teetered on the brink symbolized by disappearance and reappearance of our flag.  The potential of that loss is captured in Keys&#039; phrases and emotions.  Of all the songs written, none capture this frailty, defiance and hope half so well.  Even supposing another song its equal, that would be insufficient to change it now when it is burned in our hearts and a symbol to all the world of our freedom.  Any change now signals a loss of resolve that would be unconscionable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Meller contradicts himself when he says: </p>
<p>“An attitude of militarism and warmongering defaces the Star Spangled Banner, seriously compromising its value to our nation whose ideals, at least, always included peace, even though we would be prepared to fight to DEFEND ourselves!”  </p>
<p>By his own admission, self-defense is not warmongering and that is precisely the case the Star Spangled Banner describes.  Only the final verse of the poem makes any reference to conquest, and that he must be taking out of context.  The full final stanza of the poem reads:</p>
<p>“O thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand<br />
Between their loved home and the war&#8217;s desolation!<br />
Blest with victory and peace, may the Heaven-rescued land<br />
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.<br />
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,<br />
And this be our motto: “In God is our trust.”<br />
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave<br />
O&#8217;er the land of the free and the home of the brave!”</p>
<p>&#8216;Conquer&#8217; in this context (and as commonly used in Keys time) included conquering an enemy attacking us on our own soil .  Throughout his poem, Keys describes the valiant fight by Americans defending home and country against an enemy out to destroy us and deprive us of freedom.  Is this not precisely the case Mr. Meller makes as being legitimate?</p>
<p>It is clear, however, Meller is not just against aggressive war but against all war, and can find ample means to vilify defensive war as he does aggression by simply imposing extraneous causes that justify our enemies.  This is hardly a new theme, and Meller’s complaint rings hollow with it.</p>
<p>Meller, like many pacifists, would hobble us against all war on the presumption there is never a legitimate or just case for it.  He would have us restrict ourselves to defense only against invasion once the enemy is on our soil and has every advantage.  Frequently in war, that is too late and suicidal.  Enemies do not invade when their strength is insufficient to their designs; they invade when success seems a foregone conclusion.  Pacifism often seems noble, but it can also be incredibly stupid.</p>
<p>It is interesting Meller mentions Irving Berlin and the congressman who objected on the basis of Berlin&#8217;s Jewishness.  I am also a Jew and I know this story.   The story is apocryphal, though it may have substance.  However, it is unlikely that all the congressmen who voted down the proposal were motivated by bigotry.   Many simply saw no reason to change our national anthem, and I tend to agree.  America the Beautiful is a great song.  So are Battle Cry of Freedom, The Battle Hymn of the Republic,  God Bless the USA, Hail Columbia, The Liberty Bell, My Country, &#8216;Tis of Thee, This is My Country, This Land Is Your Land, You&#8217;re a Grand Old Flag.  And, so is our Star Spangled Banner.  Our anthem recalls a moment in our history when our country teetered on the brink symbolized by disappearance and reappearance of our flag.  The potential of that loss is captured in Keys&#8217; phrases and emotions.  Of all the songs written, none capture this frailty, defiance and hope half so well.  Even supposing another song its equal, that would be insufficient to change it now when it is burned in our hearts and a symbol to all the world of our freedom.  Any change now signals a loss of resolve that would be unconscionable.</p>
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		<title>By: L.L.M.</title>
		<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/07/02/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/comment-page-1/#comment-11135</link>
		<dc:creator>L.L.M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jul 2006 18:49:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/#comment-11135</guid>
		<description>This country came into existence with a history of its own. No Pain, no gain. May it be war or peace, the ideal behind it speaks for all who treasure freedom.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This country came into existence with a history of its own. No Pain, no gain. May it be war or peace, the ideal behind it speaks for all who treasure freedom.</p>
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		<title>By: David K. Meller</title>
		<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/07/02/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/comment-page-1/#comment-11130</link>
		<dc:creator>David K. Meller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jul 2006 17:16:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/#comment-11130</guid>
		<description>Sorry, but my favorite is Irving Berlin&#039;s God Bless America. Written toward the end of World War I, I think that  Mr. Berlin&#039;s masterpiece demonstrates every American&#039;s deepest feelings about the greatest country on Earth, While remaining true to the basic GODLINESS of our republic.

An attitude of militarism and warmongering defaces the Star Spangled Banner, seriously compromising its value to our nation whose ideals, at least, always included peace, even though we would  be prepared to fight to DEFEND ourselves!

There is no militarism defacing God Bless America, there is no reference to the attendent bloodshed and loathsome warmongering which has so often corrupted and polluted the history of our great homeland and its government, there are no &quot;bombs bursting in air&quot; there is not even a reference to the American flag!

It is a glorious hymn to the wonders of this country, its people&#039;s quiet and dignified love of  our land, to our faith in the almighty, and I submit that it deserves to be our national anthem!

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!
David K. Meller

PS- One reason God Bless America was denied its deserved status as our National Anthem was because some idiot congressmen in the 1930&#039;s took objection to the fact that its author was an immigrant Jew ( Irving Berlin CHOSE to be an American, but the congressbigots who objected  did nothing except for getting born here!) DKM

Of course the song America the Beautiful is very nice too!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, but my favorite is Irving Berlin&#8217;s God Bless America. Written toward the end of World War I, I think that  Mr. Berlin&#8217;s masterpiece demonstrates every American&#8217;s deepest feelings about the greatest country on Earth, While remaining true to the basic GODLINESS of our republic.</p>
<p>An attitude of militarism and warmongering defaces the Star Spangled Banner, seriously compromising its value to our nation whose ideals, at least, always included peace, even though we would  be prepared to fight to DEFEND ourselves!</p>
<p>There is no militarism defacing God Bless America, there is no reference to the attendent bloodshed and loathsome warmongering which has so often corrupted and polluted the history of our great homeland and its government, there are no &#8220;bombs bursting in air&#8221; there is not even a reference to the American flag!</p>
<p>It is a glorious hymn to the wonders of this country, its people&#8217;s quiet and dignified love of  our land, to our faith in the almighty, and I submit that it deserves to be our national anthem!</p>
<p>GOD BLESS AMERICA!!<br />
David K. Meller</p>
<p>PS- One reason God Bless America was denied its deserved status as our National Anthem was because some idiot congressmen in the 1930&#8242;s took objection to the fact that its author was an immigrant Jew ( Irving Berlin CHOSE to be an American, but the congressbigots who objected  did nothing except for getting born here!) DKM</p>
<p>Of course the song America the Beautiful is very nice too!</p>
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		<title>By: J. Muscoreil</title>
		<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/07/02/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/comment-page-1/#comment-11126</link>
		<dc:creator>J. Muscoreil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jul 2006 14:28:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/#comment-11126</guid>
		<description>Plainly, the greatest, most powerful, richest, brilliant, and most charitable nation that has ever graced God&#039;s green earth!  I teach my daughters to know only God and a million men or so love them more than their father.  Those million men?  Every soldier that has ever served and died to protect the time and place we occupy now.  For there is no greater love than this that a man lay down his life for his friends.  Not for his wife, daughter, or ideas, but for his friends, yet even the ones that now only exist in the Divine Mind, but thereafter, we pray will be taught to love their God, their family, and the country whose heroes died so they could have those first two great privilileges,  Let Freedom Ring!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Plainly, the greatest, most powerful, richest, brilliant, and most charitable nation that has ever graced God&#8217;s green earth!  I teach my daughters to know only God and a million men or so love them more than their father.  Those million men?  Every soldier that has ever served and died to protect the time and place we occupy now.  For there is no greater love than this that a man lay down his life for his friends.  Not for his wife, daughter, or ideas, but for his friends, yet even the ones that now only exist in the Divine Mind, but thereafter, we pray will be taught to love their God, their family, and the country whose heroes died so they could have those first two great privilileges,  Let Freedom Ring!</p>
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		<title>By: L.L.M.</title>
		<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/07/02/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/comment-page-1/#comment-11093</link>
		<dc:creator>L.L.M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Jul 2006 19:48:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2006/the-red-white-and-blue-forever-may-it-wave/#comment-11093</guid>
		<description>&quot;The Red, White and Blue: Forever May it Wave!&quot; 
Yea! Yea!! Yea!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The Red, White and Blue: Forever May it Wave!&#8221;<br />
Yea! Yea!! Yea!!!</p>
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