Comments on: Obama: Fear and the Security Force http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/ Conservative and Libertarian Intellectual Philosophy and Politics Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:04:57 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Last Angry Man http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75232 Last Angry Man Sun, 30 Nov 2008 03:12:04 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75232 "chester arthur" How ironic you use this username. My distant relative and my last name. :) "chester arthur"

How ironic you use this username. My distant relative and my last name. :)

]]> By: chester arthur http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75228 chester arthur Sat, 29 Nov 2008 02:07:43 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75228 The whole forced volunteer system proposed by the Obamists is most like the cultural revolution corps of China in the late 60's.They used fear,confrontation,and intimidation as a beginning point,and expanded their techniques to include denunciation,spying,and violence against intellectuals and actual trained professionals who do the real work of society.They had to be firmly trounced on by Mao and friends to end what Mao had thought would be a great way of indoctrinating youth and radicalizing society.It nearly destroyed even a communist dictatorship.It was tried again in Cambodia in the late 70's by Pol Pot.I think we who know history remember how that worked out.These things get out of control quite quickly.Remember,those that don't know the lessons of history....voted for Obama. The whole forced volunteer system proposed by the Obamists is most like the cultural revolution corps of China in the late 60's.They used fear,confrontation,and intimidation as a beginning point,and expanded their techniques to include denunciation,spying,and violence against intellectuals and actual trained professionals who do the real work of society.They had to be firmly trounced on by Mao and friends to end what Mao had thought would be a great way of indoctrinating youth and radicalizing society.It nearly destroyed even a communist dictatorship.It was tried again in Cambodia in the late 70's by Pol Pot.I think we who know history remember how that worked out.These things get out of control quite quickly.Remember,those that don't know the lessons of history….voted for Obama.

]]> By: NHGrouch http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75174 NHGrouch Sun, 23 Nov 2008 19:54:17 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75174 First, the article has a great deal of merit. Second, stop with the fallacious left wing - right wing crap. That's a political definition that's erroneous. Let me explain. On a left-right political chart you have a horizontal line. The extreme left end is marked Communism and the extreme right end Fascism or Nazism. Ridiculous because both had more in common that not. An accurate and correct chart would have Anarchism on one end and Totalitarianism at the opposite extreme. That would be accurate. Anarchism means a total absence of government. Totalitarianism means an all powerful government that controls everything by brute force and answers to no one but itself. Both communism and Nazism share that stage. So does Pharaohism; totalitarianism is the same no matter what label it's called or flag it flies under. Third, the Left, as it's presently known, is anything but anarchist. It is totalitarian in nature. It claims tolerance but is tolerant only of those who agree with it's agenda. Disagree with it's agenda and you're viciously attacked, sometimes by brute force. When it controls the government it's the government that applies the force; just look at the old USSR, or China or Pol Pot's Cambodia. The Left wants to mandate all facets of life in accordance with its agenda. It brooks no disagreement or opposition. Thus it has wears the same mantle and uses the same tactics as the Nazis who are allegedly their opposite. In any event, all forms of totalitarianism are anathema to America as founded. Unfortunately we have drifted away from that and the further we drift towards the left the further we drift towards totalitarianism. My fear is that with promises of Utopia most Americans will march into slavery, singing and dancing as they go! First, the article has a great deal of merit.

Second, stop with the fallacious left wing – right wing crap. That's a political definition that's erroneous. Let me explain.

On a left-right political chart you have a horizontal line. The extreme left end is marked Communism and the extreme right end Fascism or Nazism. Ridiculous because both had more in common that not.

An accurate and correct chart would have Anarchism on one end and Totalitarianism at the opposite extreme. That would be accurate.

Anarchism means a total absence of government. Totalitarianism means an all powerful government that controls everything by brute force and answers to no one but itself. Both communism and Nazism share that stage. So does Pharaohism; totalitarianism is the same no matter what label it's called or flag it flies under.

Third, the Left, as it's presently known, is anything but anarchist. It is totalitarian in nature. It claims tolerance but is tolerant only of those who agree with it's agenda. Disagree with it's agenda and you're viciously attacked, sometimes by brute force. When it controls the government it's the government that applies the force; just look at the old USSR, or China or Pol Pot's Cambodia.

The Left wants to mandate all facets of life in accordance with its agenda. It brooks no disagreement or opposition. Thus it has wears the same mantle and uses the same tactics as the Nazis who are allegedly their opposite.

In any event, all forms of totalitarianism are anathema to America as founded. Unfortunately we have drifted away from that and the further we drift towards the left the further we drift towards totalitarianism. My fear is that with promises of Utopia most Americans will march into slavery, singing and dancing as they go!

]]> By: Last Angry Man http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75159 Last Angry Man Sun, 23 Nov 2008 02:09:39 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75159 Jonkon: Ain't that the truth. Isn't it interesting. In a historical sense, the worst wars between nations used to be between relative (nobility closely related). A prime example is WWI, in which Kaiser Wilhelm, Tsar Nicholas, and king George V were all cousins. Between them in better times, they were "Willy," "Nicky," and "Georgie." Well, it was the same during WWII in a similar sense. The USSR and Nazi Germany were two movements of the Left fighting a cataclysmic battle for world dominance. Jonkon:

Ain't that the truth.

Isn't it interesting. In a historical sense, the worst wars between nations used to be between relative (nobility closely related). A prime example is WWI, in which Kaiser Wilhelm, Tsar Nicholas, and king George V were all cousins. Between them in better times, they were "Willy," "Nicky," and "Georgie."

Well, it was the same during WWII in a similar sense. The USSR and Nazi Germany were two movements of the Left fighting a cataclysmic battle for world dominance.

]]> By: jonkon http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75150 jonkon Sat, 22 Nov 2008 21:38:15 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75150 Nazism is "right-wing" only because Hitler had the audacity to invade Papa Joe's Mother Russia. Nazism is "right-wing" only because Hitler had the audacity to invade Papa Joe's Mother Russia.

]]> By: Ivan Ivanovich http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75146 Ivan Ivanovich Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:38:43 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75146 Wisco If you insist on looking at the world of politics in a one dimensional right/left way there is little that anyone can write that will convince you, so I withdraw from this conversation. Wisco
If you insist on looking at the world of politics in a one dimensional right/left way there is little that anyone can write that will convince you, so I withdraw from this conversation.

]]> By: Last Angry Man http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75144 Last Angry Man Sat, 22 Nov 2008 10:35:22 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75144 On reflection, perhaps I should not have used the Spanish Civil War as an loose indicator of a start-date, since it does appear to imply I am including it in my post; my mistake. But that *is* the period when Fascism (in Italy and other European states) and National Socialism were on a steep rise to power. On reflection, perhaps I should not have used the Spanish Civil War as an loose indicator of a start-date, since it does appear to imply I am including it in my post; my mistake. But that *is* the period when Fascism (in Italy and other European states) and National Socialism were on a steep rise to power.

]]> By: Last Angry Man http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75143 Last Angry Man Sat, 22 Nov 2008 10:27:52 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75143 WH: I provided a time-span beginning around the start of the Spanish Civil War (e.g. around the rise of Hitler); I did not discuss the peculiar Fascism of Spain itself. If my point was unclear, re-read the entire thread. These movements are virtually all from the Left, not the Right. WH: I provided a time-span beginning around the start of the Spanish Civil War (e.g. around the rise of Hitler); I did not discuss the peculiar Fascism of Spain itself.

If my point was unclear, re-read the entire thread. These movements are virtually all from the Left, not the Right.

]]> By: Patrick Mulligan http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75141 Patrick Mulligan Sat, 22 Nov 2008 04:04:48 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75141 Wisco, Perhaps a definition of National Socialism would help you better understand the foundational components of its ideology: <i>National Socialism typically promotes uniting the working class of a specific ethnic, national, or racial group into a proletarian nation while opposing capitalism, communism, conservatism, international socialism, liberalism. It also opposes nations, ethnicities or other groups that are deemed to be enemies of National Socialism.</i> - taken from www.wikipedia.org Now perhaps my understanding of the terms "left" and "right" in the context of American politics is deficient, but it is not typically the "right", in my understading, who advocates the elevation of the proletariat and opposes capitalism, while also suppressing dissent and rights of those who believe differently. Authoritarianism is a product of the "left". Socialism is a product of the "left". Authoritarian socialism is a combination of two products of the "left". National socialism was not, is not, and has never been, a "rightist" concept. <i>you need to check your facts as to what leftist and rightist are, and which systems/parties adhere to what.</i> You'd do well to take your own advice. I pray to God that your graduate work isn't in political science... Wisco,

Perhaps a definition of National Socialism would help you better understand the foundational components of its ideology:

National Socialism typically promotes uniting the working class of a specific ethnic, national, or racial group into a proletarian nation while opposing capitalism, communism, conservatism, international socialism, liberalism. It also opposes nations, ethnicities or other groups that are deemed to be enemies of National Socialism. – taken from http://www.wikipedia.org

Now perhaps my understanding of the terms "left" and "right" in the context of American politics is deficient, but it is not typically the "right", in my understading, who advocates the elevation of the proletariat and opposes capitalism, while also suppressing dissent and rights of those who believe differently. Authoritarianism is a product of the "left". Socialism is a product of the "left". Authoritarian socialism is a combination of two products of the "left". National socialism was not, is not, and has never been, a "rightist" concept.

you need to check your facts as to what leftist and rightist are, and which systems/parties adhere to what.

You'd do well to take your own advice.

I pray to God that your graduate work isn't in political science…

]]> By: WiscoHippie http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/comment-page-1/#comment-75139 WiscoHippie Sat, 22 Nov 2008 03:18:54 +0000 http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2008/11/19/obama-fear-and-the-security-force/#comment-75139 1. Socialism and Communism are from the left, yes; National Socialism, though, is from the right. And I, too, am leftist. Hi. 2.Spanish Fascism was anti-communist. Where are you getting your facts? 3. Leftist movements are not always radical. In fact, they're the establishment in most of Western Europe, especially in Scandinavia, where folks are pretty happy with the way things are (at least those I've talked to). But radicalism isn't necessarily a bad thing (sometimes it is, but not all the time). I'm unclear as to what your point is, though, and you need to check your facts as to what leftist and rightist are, and which systems/parties adhere to what. Thanks for talking Nick 1. Socialism and Communism are from the left, yes; National Socialism, though, is from the right. And I, too, am leftist. Hi.

2.Spanish Fascism was anti-communist. Where are you getting your facts?

3. Leftist movements are not always radical. In fact, they're the establishment in most of Western Europe, especially in Scandinavia, where folks are pretty happy with the way things are (at least those I've talked to). But radicalism isn't necessarily a bad thing (sometimes it is, but not all the time).

I'm unclear as to what your point is, though, and you need to check your facts as to what leftist and rightist are, and which systems/parties adhere to what.

Thanks for talking
Nick

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