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	<title>Comments on: Some Reflections on &#8220;Torture&#8221;</title>
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	<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2009/06/09/some-reflections-on-torture/</link>
	<description>Conservative and Libertarian Intellectual Philosophy and Politics</description>
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		<title>By: Guillaume</title>
		<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2009/06/09/some-reflections-on-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-78580</link>
		<dc:creator>Guillaume</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 01:42:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.intellectualconservative.com/?p=6136#comment-78580</guid>
		<description>The article is excellent! I hope King Jong-Il reads it when he decides what &quot;interrogation procedures&quot; should be taken when investigating Laura Ling and Euna Lee, who entered North Korea illegally and are accused of engaging in &quot;hostile acts.&quot; Thanks a lot Comrade Kerwick</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The article is excellent! I hope King Jong-Il reads it when he decides what &#8220;interrogation procedures&#8221; should be taken when investigating Laura Ling and Euna Lee, who entered North Korea illegally and are accused of engaging in &#8220;hostile acts.&#8221; Thanks a lot Comrade Kerwick</p>
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		<title>By: Dale Swanson</title>
		<link>http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2009/06/09/some-reflections-on-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-78523</link>
		<dc:creator>Dale Swanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 06:58:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.intellectualconservative.com/?p=6136#comment-78523</guid>
		<description>Well then, let&#039;s jump in and get it going. There are some basic concepts in your article which are provocative. Probably one of the better presentations which I have read.

First in our Western World we are flumoxed when trying to discuss Islam and in other instances the mind of the terrorist. The extremists throughout the world have an ideology which is mostly a mystery to the leadership of our country. The ruling Elite can make dangerous decisions becuase they are protected by the Forces of our Government.

Planned violence against a benign citizenry is at the heart of tyranny and terrorism. The terrorist functions in ideological framework which is not understood by the 
Socialist mentality or by many in the streets of the Western World.

When considering the lesser of two evils as in a military conflict or in the case of the child returned to the parent, there are rules or laws of Universals which govern behavior. Those not involved in the taking of alife or experiencing the destruction of life as 9/11 or a violent expression of evil do not understand the rules which govern the use of &quot;torture&quot; to gain information to reduce further violence.

Beleiving in Intelligent Design increases the personal internal reaction to using persuasive techniques. Believing in a Personal Creator brings more internal turmoil in sorting out the 1) use of extreme pressure to produce information for the protection of ideals 2) the giving of an account to a higher power than a legal system as in the distinction between legal and moral 3)satisfaction of legal permission without permission in the moral produces guilt.

Any form of pressure / torture cannot be a betrayal of Made In His Image which means I have no freedom to deface the the Image of God in a Human being - verbally, emotionally, spiritually, physically.

Allowing the legal system to establish permission without moral permission is to bring the political establishment closer to tyranny. Legal persmission is often used as an excuse to be Schizophrenic in Thought when making deeply personal decision in the Secular sytem vs making decisions in the personal and closed area of my inner self separate from my public life.

Words are powerful. Terrorist, Torture, Violence, Legal Permission, Moral Permission are words used in this discussion. The left uses loaded words to frame the debate.

The Liberal Socialist Progressive Statist uses the power of words to frame the debate in such a way the Conservative drifts into the use of words framed by the Pragmatist (Elite).

For example, the word violence in the vocabulary of the Conservative is modified by the phrase &quot;justified violence.&quot; Justified violence doesn&#039;t really change how the Left uses the word, because their use of Justice is found by the use of Rationlistic Relativism.

Torture is viewed as all you say in your article. There are deeper issues which govern the use of Force in producing a pressure to give information (Torture). In order for some form of Torture to be used on Enemy Combatants - in this case Terrorists - the Athiest / Evolutionist is the quickest to acquiesce because there in no External Universal which govern their actions.

Torture - limited - may be a legitimate use of Force to restrain evil. If so, then another word needs to be used to describe the process.

Force is escalated to meet and eliminate a violent, unrelenting imposition of the autocratic will. Retaliation with a higher level of force is always justified by Universals and Intelligent Design. And by definition permit a moral acceptance. Methods of extracting information are governed by philosophical considerations. 

Making decisions which are repugnant do not have to be morally wrong. This needs to be pursued.

Because of the weakness of the Western World in dealing with the ideologically bizarre thought process of the Terriorist and their national governments, the &quot;powers that be&quot; have struggled to find the limits of persuasion.

Bowing to a bully, or one who has no respect is a certain function which produces more random violence from the Terrorist toward the weak. Domination is hidden in the thought process of the Bully. The ever expanding expression of domination through whatever means is always at the center of being for the bully.

The body language of the Western Powers sends a message of weakness to the opposing powers. The Bully spirit never backs down and always pushes the boundaries. The West exemplifies the loss of power and the loss of control.

So the West resorts to limited torture to bring forth information from within the core of the Terrorist or the Enemy Combatant. The mental gymanastics are admirable and many times convincing.

The debate is muddied by the extreme wealth of the Left and the corrupt Right. They are able to remain secure by paying for protection, security, boundaries which keep out the terrorist&#039;s arena. They are smug - I won&#039;t add the noun here - in their secure positions. Our military and other protective institutions keep them safe. So they make decisions which lead the Western World into an escalation of the violence and then the use of measured torture.

If the West would use shear force to bring submission to a cooperative position, very little persuasive techinques would need to be used. So let me add a bit to the fire of debate - what do you think about this one::grins::?

   The battle in the South Pacific required an almost complete annihilation of the Enemy and eventually the destruction of Nag-ki and Hir-ma. The mindset of the enemy was shaped by a unique ideology. Force was escalated to a point where submission was almost guarenteed. The cost was atrocious.

So the use of Force has descended/escalated into the use of Torture to some degree because of the Elite Ruling Class&#039; loss of respect for Man as Man, Made in the Image of God.

The hypocrisy of the Left screams loudly to the ears of one who is willing to listen. Personal belief for family is radically different than the belief system which governs their public life. True hypocrisy which will bring about the further decay of Constitutional Truth. So the use of torture escalates and the West drifts toward Law based upon the power of the Elite - Rex Lex.

What do you think??
Have a great day!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well then, let&#8217;s jump in and get it going. There are some basic concepts in your article which are provocative. Probably one of the better presentations which I have read.</p>
<p>First in our Western World we are flumoxed when trying to discuss Islam and in other instances the mind of the terrorist. The extremists throughout the world have an ideology which is mostly a mystery to the leadership of our country. The ruling Elite can make dangerous decisions becuase they are protected by the Forces of our Government.</p>
<p>Planned violence against a benign citizenry is at the heart of tyranny and terrorism. The terrorist functions in ideological framework which is not understood by the<br />
Socialist mentality or by many in the streets of the Western World.</p>
<p>When considering the lesser of two evils as in a military conflict or in the case of the child returned to the parent, there are rules or laws of Universals which govern behavior. Those not involved in the taking of alife or experiencing the destruction of life as 9/11 or a violent expression of evil do not understand the rules which govern the use of &#8220;torture&#8221; to gain information to reduce further violence.</p>
<p>Beleiving in Intelligent Design increases the personal internal reaction to using persuasive techniques. Believing in a Personal Creator brings more internal turmoil in sorting out the 1) use of extreme pressure to produce information for the protection of ideals 2) the giving of an account to a higher power than a legal system as in the distinction between legal and moral 3)satisfaction of legal permission without permission in the moral produces guilt.</p>
<p>Any form of pressure / torture cannot be a betrayal of Made In His Image which means I have no freedom to deface the the Image of God in a Human being &#8211; verbally, emotionally, spiritually, physically.</p>
<p>Allowing the legal system to establish permission without moral permission is to bring the political establishment closer to tyranny. Legal persmission is often used as an excuse to be Schizophrenic in Thought when making deeply personal decision in the Secular sytem vs making decisions in the personal and closed area of my inner self separate from my public life.</p>
<p>Words are powerful. Terrorist, Torture, Violence, Legal Permission, Moral Permission are words used in this discussion. The left uses loaded words to frame the debate.</p>
<p>The Liberal Socialist Progressive Statist uses the power of words to frame the debate in such a way the Conservative drifts into the use of words framed by the Pragmatist (Elite).</p>
<p>For example, the word violence in the vocabulary of the Conservative is modified by the phrase &#8220;justified violence.&#8221; Justified violence doesn&#8217;t really change how the Left uses the word, because their use of Justice is found by the use of Rationlistic Relativism.</p>
<p>Torture is viewed as all you say in your article. There are deeper issues which govern the use of Force in producing a pressure to give information (Torture). In order for some form of Torture to be used on Enemy Combatants &#8211; in this case Terrorists &#8211; the Athiest / Evolutionist is the quickest to acquiesce because there in no External Universal which govern their actions.</p>
<p>Torture &#8211; limited &#8211; may be a legitimate use of Force to restrain evil. If so, then another word needs to be used to describe the process.</p>
<p>Force is escalated to meet and eliminate a violent, unrelenting imposition of the autocratic will. Retaliation with a higher level of force is always justified by Universals and Intelligent Design. And by definition permit a moral acceptance. Methods of extracting information are governed by philosophical considerations. </p>
<p>Making decisions which are repugnant do not have to be morally wrong. This needs to be pursued.</p>
<p>Because of the weakness of the Western World in dealing with the ideologically bizarre thought process of the Terriorist and their national governments, the &#8220;powers that be&#8221; have struggled to find the limits of persuasion.</p>
<p>Bowing to a bully, or one who has no respect is a certain function which produces more random violence from the Terrorist toward the weak. Domination is hidden in the thought process of the Bully. The ever expanding expression of domination through whatever means is always at the center of being for the bully.</p>
<p>The body language of the Western Powers sends a message of weakness to the opposing powers. The Bully spirit never backs down and always pushes the boundaries. The West exemplifies the loss of power and the loss of control.</p>
<p>So the West resorts to limited torture to bring forth information from within the core of the Terrorist or the Enemy Combatant. The mental gymanastics are admirable and many times convincing.</p>
<p>The debate is muddied by the extreme wealth of the Left and the corrupt Right. They are able to remain secure by paying for protection, security, boundaries which keep out the terrorist&#8217;s arena. They are smug &#8211; I won&#8217;t add the noun here &#8211; in their secure positions. Our military and other protective institutions keep them safe. So they make decisions which lead the Western World into an escalation of the violence and then the use of measured torture.</p>
<p>If the West would use shear force to bring submission to a cooperative position, very little persuasive techinques would need to be used. So let me add a bit to the fire of debate &#8211; what do you think about this one::grins::?</p>
<p>   The battle in the South Pacific required an almost complete annihilation of the Enemy and eventually the destruction of Nag-ki and Hir-ma. The mindset of the enemy was shaped by a unique ideology. Force was escalated to a point where submission was almost guarenteed. The cost was atrocious.</p>
<p>So the use of Force has descended/escalated into the use of Torture to some degree because of the Elite Ruling Class&#8217; loss of respect for Man as Man, Made in the Image of God.</p>
<p>The hypocrisy of the Left screams loudly to the ears of one who is willing to listen. Personal belief for family is radically different than the belief system which governs their public life. True hypocrisy which will bring about the further decay of Constitutional Truth. So the use of torture escalates and the West drifts toward Law based upon the power of the Elite &#8211; Rex Lex.</p>
<p>What do you think??<br />
Have a great day!</p>
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